Professor Ezra Vogel, Professor of Harvard University of Social Sciences, USA, was 90 years old. When he was invited by the Middle East Institute of the National University of Singapore in mid -January, he accepted an exclusive interview with Lianhe Morning Post and ThinkChina;The professor's spirit is good. After an hour of English interviews, I will continue to do Chinese video interviews.No matter which language, he does not need to read the problem in advance or prepare.Fu Gaoyi has a number of works on East Asian works. In 1979, Japan was the first classic to understand Japan's rise and assist the United States for preparations for the world situation of the Japanese economy in the 1980s.Writing, clarify the role of Deng Xiaoping in the process of establishing a modern China; the new works published last year China and Japan used streamlined text to sort out the relationship between the relationship between China and Japan for more than 1,400 years.

Bilahari Kausikan, chairman of the National University of the National University of China, praised Professor Fu Gaoyi in Facebook as an invincible emperor in East Asian research.Hearing the reporter told him that he couldn't believe it haha: Really?He said hell; hellip;

Fu Gaoyi was born in a Jewish family in Ohio, USA in 1930. He graduated from Harvard University. He began teaching in his alma mater in 1964. In 1972, he replaced Fei Zhengqing (John K.Fairbank) and served as the East Asian Research Center of Harvard University (now known as the China Research Center :)The second director.Central website introduction: In the 1990s, Fu Gaoyi served as East Asian intelligence officer of the National Intelligence Commission during the White House of Clinton.

Visit with a professor starts with his hometown of the United States.

In Fu Gaoyi's eyes, the United States has been a country with development momentum since the end of the 19th century. Open immigration and national policies have unlimited social ideas.In the past 100 years, the United States has been used to its position as the world's most powerful forces.

We are the only international forces that have performed well after World War II and have a special location.I am deeply proud of our generation's performance, which is my generation.

Today, the United States knows that in the face of corporate relocation, scientific and technological transfer, and competition in cheap labor in other countries, the economic foundation is not as good as before.And in front of the United States is a China that follows the United States in economic development and national strength.

This is amazing for the United States!In particular, China's political system is different from the United States. The communist system is terrible for the United States, and the proletariat is terrible to us.

How many mountains?

Fu Gaoyi said that in Washington in the United States, there are strong anti -China emotions regardless of the Democratic or Republican Party.

However, Fu Gaoyi, who had been in East Asia for six years, in July 2019, he published with several scholars who have been engaged in Chinese issues for a long time.And make a seven -point suggestion.The public letter obtained a signature of a hundred scholars, and a large number of scholars signed support through the Internet after the publication.

It can be seen that Fu Gaoyi starts from goodwill, and hopes that China and the United States, who is trapped in the muds of trade and science and technology, still finds the opportunity to cooperate.One mountain and two tigers?The reporter couldn't help asking: Is it possible?

Fu Gaoyi said optimistically that it was not reasonable to think that the United States could not coexist with other power.The cooperation of a strong country is good for everyone.China and the United States are very different, but I don't think that a mountain can only be tolerated the next tiger, and there can be many tigers.

Many tigers?

Fu Gaoyi said with a smile: Yes.As long as they don't be too fierce.

Americans are worried about China's unfairness

The two tigers fight each other, there must be a injury.The suggestion of Fu Gaoyi is that China and the United States are self -restraining in international behavior, establish a cooperation mechanism and understanding, and cultivate trust.

Many Chinese people think that the United States is trying to curb China and believe that American imperialism is not dead; many Americans are also worried that China's national strength will be enhanced and will pressure domestic people and other countries.It is an example of the Chinese regime that must change the status quo and suppress the human rights of freedom and democracy, and will also extend China's political influence outside the border.

Fu Gaoyi said: The question is that China will continue to allow American companies to operate in China, just like when she is a student.Still studying, just want to expel foreign companies?Will the Chinese government favor Chinese enterprises and participate in the deportation process?

He talked about the strong justice of Americans and believed in sports spirit and fair competition.When we are afraid of the other person's unfairness, we will be very angry, lsquo; unhappy rsquo;.Americans think: Is China competing fairly?Is it based on reasonable rules?

Is China in the eyes of Fu Gaoyi's eyes a fair country?He said that although considering that China's national conditions are complicated, it is not easy to unite 1.4 billion people and cannot be comprehensive, but there are many examples in one breath.Although China has opportunities for other countries, Google cannot openly operate in China, and it is difficult for foreign experts to obtain Chinese archives.U.S. consulates, such as the Consulate in Guangzhou, cannot meet the top Chinese scholars.It is not convenient for foreigners to find information with Chinese libraries; many Americans cannot get visas. People who have been waiting in Xinjiang, even those who have been waiting for 15 or 20 years ago are refused to visa.

Fu Gaoyi said that for Americans, these methods are not bright enough.In the past, we did not use such a closed way to treat foreigners, so the United States is now vigilant.How can the United States deal with if China is so strong?How to protect our high -end technology will not be easily used by foreigners to benefit themselves, which is not good for the United States?

The level of opening up in Chinese society declines

In Fu Gaoyi's view, the openness of Chinese society has declined.In his eyes, Deng Xiaoping's era, from 1978 to about 10 years ago, China was much more open than now.

Asked the reason behind this phenomenon, he said that the person who studied it could only try to understand China.His assumption is that according to the historical experience of the former Soviet Union and Gorbachev, China believes that relaxation control will lead to disintegration of the country.In particular, Chinese provinces and places are very diverse. Maintaining unity, it is necessary to tighten the control.In the past few years, China's severe punishment for corruption may also be the cause of regulation.When the domestic people (to the government) are dissatisfied, they will also feel that they need to strengthen control.

Many overseas Chinese scholars and Chinese research experts have proposed that they hope to see a more open China, because they can't see it, so they express their anxious emotions.

Is this tightening trend correct?Fu Gaoyi believes that it is difficult for foreigners to conclude for China.

It is really difficult for us foreigners to judge right or wrong.But for those who want China to succeed and care about China, for those who want China to live in harmony with the international community, we think it is impossible to control such strict control.

China now has 350,000 international students studying in the United States, and more than 100 million people go abroad each year. Therefore, they want to control the information that is impossible as some of their leaders' hope.Different opinions and sounds are omnipresent and cannot be controlled.

Young people of Hong Kong and Taiwan are looking forward to the mainland more free

As a result, the recent Hong Kong demonstration and Taiwan presidential election.Although the process is intricate and the participation of the forces is complicated, the demands of young people in the local area are to see a more open society.Fu GaoyiAgree speaking, young people look forward to more free China.

They like the current freedom and hope that the situation will continue.They suspect that if their city is regulated like Beijing, they can continue to be free.

The younger generation of Hong Kong and Taiwan is very different from the concept of social openness in Beijing. Fu Gaoyi believes that the only way to get closer is to establish the confidence of the government's confidence in allowing free space.

The Beijing authorities must be confident.If they give the people greater freedom, the state will not disintegrate; if they let the people discuss their ideological opinions publicly, they can still maintain their rule and control the system.If they are confident, they will be greater than Hong Kong and Taiwan.

But Fu Gaoyi also knew that different historical experiences made Americans and Chinese understand the ideal state of society.

The history of China in the 19th and 20th centuries, there are too many civil strife, too turbulent, and the people are hard.There are many differences in the National University, diverse culture, different living standards, and difficult to maintain order.Some people in China would rather accept strict control and sacrifice freedom in exchange for social order.

Chinese development model west does not appreciate the West

However, Fu Gaoyi said that no matter how China outputs a social development model that has risen rapidly under power, this model has no charm for Westerners who have enjoyed freedom and democracy.

We enjoy freedom in the West and will not live in a society where China is controlled in everything.In American universities, we said that if you have an idea, you can play. If there is no political supervisor, no one has reported a small report, and we report what we said in the classroom.We like this system.

We enjoy this free freedom.We believe that this freedom is the central force of our science, thought, and invention.We believe that more opportunities to express ideas are beneficial to the country in the long run.

Open society to show leaders' self -confidence

For many Asian governments and individuals, freedom and democracy in the United States often impose people and show the problems of hypocrisy and dual standards.However, Fu Gaoyi said that although the United States seems aggressive, Americans have no fantasies that China will become the same country as the United States.

After China's reform and opening up, we are willing to help, and we have been helping China to find our own direction.We do not expect China to look like us.

Of course, many people in the United States think that the democratic system is suitable for the world, but I think most of us accept it. There are many different countries and different folklore traditions in the world.However, Americans agree that when the country is economically successful, the people must have the right to come and go, and they will become an open and loose social mdash; mdash; not too much authoritarian dictatorship to cooperate with other countries.

Many people in the United States have questioned, will China open?Will it bring opportunities to help her get the economy?

Can China be like Fu Gaoyi's expectations?He is still an old saying: unless Chinese leaders have such confidence.

It is impossible for China and the United States to be completely decoupled

Sino -US 源 stems from deeper concepts and cultural conflicts, and it is not possible to solve it by changing a president.Fu Gaoyi said that China has made achievements. Even if it is over -confidenced now, China and the United States still have to cooperate.

The world is too small and the international affairs are intricate. Especially in the environmental and international order topics, we must find out common interests and move forward together.Many Americans are working hard.Although China is sometimes tough, some Chinese are proud, and they always teach the United States.Of course, some Americans like to teach Chinese, but they still have to cooperate.

China is very powerful, the economy is huge, and science and technology have improved.The world is too small to separate.

In Fu Gaoyi's opinion, the decoupling of public opinion is nonsense.

It is simply impossible for China and the United States to be completely decoupled.How can 350,000 Chinese students in the United States be decoupled?Perhaps high -tech companies will refuse to share scientific and technological achievements, but the company is very flexible. If you do not import it from China and transfer to Vietnam, Vietnam will also be transferred.Chinese students will also bring back to foreign technology and products. How can they be decoupled?

Japan has apologized

Fu Gaoyi's new works have brilliant insights on the evolution of Sino -Japanese relations in China and Japan.Many Chinese, including overseas Chinese, discuss Japan's national strength, will always mention Japan's crimes of World War II and they have not solemnly apologized.Fu Gaoyi disagreed.He said that Japan apologized more than once.

(Prime Minister of Japan) Murakami (1995) has officially apologized, especially the destruction and evil in World War II.(Japan) Other political leaders have also apologized.

However, Fu Gaoyi agreed that Japan can do more to improve their image in the eyes of Chinese and Southeast Asia.

If Japanese students can know more about World War II, they can admit it more publicly and are richer in detail; allowing Japanese people to know more, they can establish a better relationship with Asian countries.

Fu Gaoyi, who has deep origin with Japan, talked about this problem with the Japanese.He said that the Japanese response was: since the Second World War, Japan has performed well; pursuing peace, sharing resources with other countries, especially in terms of information and technology, although apologies are not always apologized, they also apologized.

The Japanese will say that we have become a good citizen in international international citizens, but others do not realize our efforts, and the Chinese have not realized our efforts.But the Chinese said: The Japanese did not apologize.I think both parties can establish a relationship more sincerely.

Chinese and Japanese Americans

The United States is a hegemon of one party, and China is the rise of the rise; some analysis treats Japan as a country where national strength is in a decline.Japan's international influence and economy rankings have been surpassed by China, facing the problems of severe aging, population reduction, and economic atrophy.Ask Fu Gaoyi what he views Japan, his answer is very interesting.

That's right, Japan is facing these issues.But if you ask the Japanese where you want to live in the world, they will answer: Oh, Japan!Because it is very clean, people are polite, the medical system is very good, the life span is long, and the crime rate is very low.

Their society is operating well, and the people live in peace and work.Japan has maintained the level of national living. Although the economic strength is not strong in China, I think that if Chinese people can enjoy the living conditions of Japanese people, they will be very happy.

The Japanese listen to the Chinese self -self -arbitrary self -self -arbitrarily

Fu Gaoyi has been at least once a year since 1958.In October last year, he spent several weeks to visit several cities in Japan.At home in Boston in the United States, he has a dinner once a month, gathered Japanese students from Boston Elite University, and talks about the future topics of Japan.

They are all worried about the future of Japan.You ask them: How is your country's economic situation?lsquo; Oh, not good.rsquo; Where do you want to live in the future?lsquo; Japan.rsquo;

But you ask the Chinese: How is your country's condition?lsquo; Oh, we are great!rsquo; Where do you want to live in the future?lsquo; Perhaps the United States, maybe Canada, Australia, or China.rsquo;

The Japanese's reply has always been clear.They are going to live in Japan and live in Japan.

Talking about the experience of communicating with the people of these countries, Fu Gaoyi has his perception.He said the Japanese knew how to listen.10 Japanese people will quickly form a harmonious organization, which is very sensitive to each other's demand, and finds the way to move forward together.

The Chinese are more self.10 Chinese people, it is easy for you to want you, I want me.

Therefore, Japan, they attach importance to harmony, attach importance to people, people's situations, and social operations are relatively smooth.

However, Fu Gaoyi emphasized that this is not a man in all over the world, but also Japanese and Chinese with different personalities.What about Americans?He laughed and said that Americans were also very self./p>

Americans are more arbitrary than the Japanese.Our country is large and diverse, there are many different views on human society, and there are many people with strong ideas.Many Americans think that the United States is facing a greater dilemma today, and the opportunity has not passed as much.New media has also split this country.When I was young, we only had a few TV stations, and we watched the same show.Today, I believe Trump's see one and disgust him to see another.Compared with the era of only a few TV stations in the past, there is a lack of mutual understanding.

The reporter asked: Is this why China needs to tighten the control?Fu Gaoyi said with a smile: China has its own problems, and their problems are more severe than the United States.